New VI3 Planning device question???

[bobmct]

Gentlemen;

I am planning to replace approx 50-60 physical DL360's and other Intel servers running various versions of Linux and win 2003 server with a VI3 with a SAN backend. I have some questions about my planned hardware selections and would appreciate some feedback and reasons thereof?

I am a long time AMD/Opteron fan but some VM partners are claiming to stay away from AMD with VI3. Any reasons why or are their margins better with Intel?

I am planning three physical servers and at this time leaning towards IBM X3xxx models. My research tends to show that the X3850 series are "faster" with VI3 than other systems. Any experience with this claim anyone?

I am planning on minimal mirrored SAS or SATA HDD internal for booting with all other disk on SAN over GBIC iSCSI. What capacity HDD internally would generally be recommended for this scheme? Hot swap?

How about RAM for these servers? I would assume maximum available but any recommendations, points appreciated?

Finally, my planned switched for my network infrastructure are Extreme Network Summit X450e Gigabit switches using a VLAN for the SAN access. Any comments on these?

I appreciate any comments, recommendations, gotchas, pointers, etc on any/all of these components and plans as this will be a relatively costly but very important implementation.

Thanks to any/all who can provide some insight/guidance.

[kharbin]

Hi Bobmct,

I like Opterons also, never had any issues using them with VMware. Although, I must admit, since using the Intel Quad Cores, I do like them better. A lot of CPU for not a lot of money. While the CPUs are not clocked as high as a Dual Core, they do have a faster internal data bus and can handle a sustained load much better than dual cores. And yes, margins are better with Intel.

As for IBM x3850 being faster than other system with VI3, can't say I've seen that. In fact, I am usually disappoanted when using IBM equipment with VMware. They never load and run ESX out of the box. There are always BIOS and firmware that have to be upgraded before it will run proper.

While I am generally not an HP fan, after 5 years of ESX consulting I must admit, HPs are probably one of the least toublesome ESX hosts of the big 3 manufactrers. Time is money, and the HPs save me time and the customer money.

As for local drives, I like to use a couple 73GB in a mirror with a hot spare. Nothing fancy, but it works well and no mainenance.

RAM, go for the max. We always exhuast RAM long, long before CPU. Most of my customers run 8 or 16 cores with 64GB RAM. Most are at 10-20% CPU used and 100% RAM used.

Even though CPU isn't taxed heavy I still find with the quad cores, you have a more even distribution of the CPU cycles across the cores, much less wait times.

As for the switches, I don't have any personal experience with that model, so I can make no credible remarks as to their performance. But I have not heard anything bad about them either.

Otherwise looks like you have a well thought plan. Although I don't see a backup plan.

Ken Harbin

www.esXpress.com

[meistermn]

Take AMD and avoid intel for virtualization projects.

Look at architecture and not at cpu benchmarks.

if you have the time to wait for october 2007, look at barcelona.

http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?i=3050

Most projects in the virtualizaion area are not successful, because it is not done in steps.

Step 1 look at application servers in 2005-2006 wich have a low,middle cpu workload, middle memory workload , low net i/o and disk i/o workloads

In step two with comming amd bacelona servers you can consolidate low,middle,high cpu workloads, middle and high memory workloads, low, middle net i/o and disk i/o workloads.

In step 3 with amd iommu in 2009 consoldate high net i/o and disk i/o workloads.

Message was edited by:

meistermn

[christianZ]

When you will take iscsi I would prefer iscsi hbas (Qlogic) - in that case when you get hp be carefully - they seem to be unsupported with hp servers.

We have here Dell servers and they support the iscsi hbas.

The choice of iscsi storage will be exciting too.

Check this for first numbers:

http://www.vmware.com/community/thread.jspa?threadID=73745

Interresting cadidates IMHO (alphabetical): Compellent, Equallogic, NetApp.

[esiebert7625]

Definitely do your homework before you purchase and implement. The AMD vs. Intel topic has been asked a few times here, below are some links on that subject. If you are using ESX make sure and use SAS drives as it does not support SATA. As you stated, get the most RAM you can, I choose to use the faster 400Mhz RAM which resulted in less total RAM but 16GB and 32GB were enough for me. Also make sure and get at least 4 NIC's in your servers, preferably 6. If you already use HP I would stick with them. Did you have problems with the HP servers? I'll admit the DL360 isn't the greatest server, it had lots of power supply problems originally but the DL380/385/580/585 servers are rock solid great servers. Read through these links below fo rmore info...

AMD vs. Intel for VMware - http://www.vmware.com/community/thread.jspa?threadID=27838

AMD & Intel Servers Compete for Ultimate Virtuality - http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/12/29/amd_and_intel_servers_compete_for_ultimate_virtuality/

What to choose, Intel or AMD? - http://blog.baeke.info/blog/_archives/2006/9/18/2338562.html

Dell Intel vs. AMD - http://www.vmware.com/community/thread.jspa?messageID=522714

Vmware Infrastructure Architecture Overview - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi_architecture_wp.pdf

Building the Virtualized Enterprise with VMware Infrastructure - http://download.101com.com/techlibrary/vmware/vmware_building_virtualized_enterprise.pdf

Introduction to ESX 3.0.1 and VirtualCenter 2.0.1 - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi3_intro_vi.pdf

Tips and tricks for implementing infrastructure services on ESX server - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/tips_tricks_infrastructure_services.pdf

Virtual Infrastructure Implementation Best Practices From A to Z - http://download3.vmware.com/vmworld/2006/adc0051.pdf

Server Consolidation with VMware ESX Server - http://www.redbooks.ibm.com/redpapers/pdfs/redp3939.pdf

Configuration Maximums for VMware Infrastructure 3 - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi3_301_201_config_max.pdf

Virtualization-optimized architectures - http://www.vmware-tsx.com/download.php?asset_id=33

ESX Workload Analysis: Lessons Learned - http://download3.vmware.com/vmworld/2006/adc9398.pdf

Getting the Right Fit: VMware ESX Workload Analysis - http://download3.vmware.com/vmworld/2005/sln056.pdf

Virtualization: Architectural Considerations and other Evaluation Criteria - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/virtualization_considerations.pdf

Production Consolidation using VMware and the AMD Opteron Processor - http://download3.vmware.com/vmworld/2006/adc9743.pdf

IBM Insights in Sizing Hardware for Virtualization - http://download3.vmware.com/vmworld/2006/tac4057.pdf

VMware ESX Server: A comprehensive guide to how ESX virtualizes HP ProLiant servers - http://h20331.www2.hp.com/ActiveAnswers/downloads/vmwareESXserver_virtualize_ProLiant_1005.pdf

HP ProLiant server sizer for VMware ESX Server - http://h71019.www7.hp.com/activeanswers/cache/120132-0-0-0-121.html

IT Consolidation using VMware CapacityPlanner on HP ProLiant servers - http://h71019.www7.hp.com/ActiveAnswers/cache/70314-0-0-225-121.html?jumpid=reg_R1002_USEN

Managing a Virtualized Proliant Environment - http://www.vmware-tsx.com/download.php?asset_id=18

HP VMware Platform Choice and Business Continuity - http://www.vmware-tsx.com/download.php?asset_id=17

Pricing, Packaging & Licensing Overview - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi_pricing.pdf

The Role of Memory in ESX Server 3 - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/esx3_memory.pdf

VMware Virtual Networking Concepts - http://www.vmware.com/files/pdf/virtual_networking_concepts.pdf

ESX3 Networking Internals - http://www.vmware-tsx.com/download.php?asset_id=41

High Performance ESX Networking - http://www.vmware-tsx.com/download.php?asset_id=43

Configuring iSCSI in a Vmware 3 environment - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi3_iscsi_cfg.pdf

Ethernet-based Storage Configuration - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/iscsi_storage_esx.pdf

iSCSI , NAS and IP Storage Configuration for Vmware ESX Server - http://download3.vmware.com/vmworld/2006/tac9722.pdf

SAN Configuration Guide - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi3_esx_san_cfg.pdf

SAN System Design and Deployment Guide - http://www.vmware.com/pdf/vi3_san_design_deploy.pdf

Choosing and Architecting Storage for your Environment - http://download3.vmware.com/vmworld/2006/adc0135.pdf

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Thanks, Eric

Visit my website: http://vmware-land.com

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