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matthiash
Contributor
Contributor

VMWare vSAN and Dell PowerEdge R730xd (13G) - Which would be the best practice controller..? Dell PERC H330, H730 or H730P..?

Hello,

i want to setup a VMWare vSAN System with 3 of the new DELL PowerEdge R730xd Server.

Every server should host 128GB DDR4-RAM and 1x DELL SSD (200GB Solid State Drive SAS Write Intensive MLC 12Gpbs 2.5") and 7x DELL HDD (600GB 10K RPM SAS 6Gbps 2.5").

But i dont know which Controller i should use.

I searched the VMWare HCL and also the internet for any informations about the new DELL PERC H330, H370 and H730P in combination with VMWare vSAN, but i can't find any information about it.

http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell-PowerEdge-RAID-Contr...

http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell-PowerEdge-RAID-Contr...

http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell-PowerEdge-RAID-Contr...

The H330 is a LSI 3008 Controller and the H730 is a LSI LSI 3108 Controller. Booth are 12Gb/s SAS controller.

The H330 and also the H730 can passthrough/raw-disk.

But at Disk Controller features and Queue Depth? there is the information that the H330 has only a queue depth of 256..! VMWare recommend 512 and more for high performance systems.

I can't find any information about the H730 so don't know if this one has more or not.

Is it worth to pay more for the H730..? Can I use the more features also in vSAN (e.g. 1GB NVcache etc).

Is there also the option to flash the H330 controller with an IT firmware to get more queue depth..?

Or should i take the H730 for my server..? But this is normally a RAID controller, but as far as i know, RAID controller is not best practice for vSAN cause vSAN don't get direct access to the disks. (this was the problem with the PERC H710 controller).

Can you help me out of "which controller should i buy" dilirium..?

Thank you.

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ezequielcarson
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Hi,

AFAIK you will not use the cache from your raid controller. So having the LSI 3008 or 3108 will make no difference.

I have both cards working in vsan and this is what i found

3008: uses pass trhu , so you will view your disks as they are. So if they are SATA you will have a DQLEN of 32 (too small for my workload)

3108: it only works in RAID-0 and uses write-thru (no write back or bbu). You will get a DQLEN of 128. BUT in my case the disks suddenly start failing and after a reload of the server or just putting the disk offline/online the disk goes up and the diskgroup becomes healthy

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matthiash
Contributor
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Hey,

so i should take the H330 for my setup..?! DQLEN of 32..? also with SAS..?

so with the H730 i can't do VSAN pass-through so only this Virtual SAN RAID 0..?

thats not good... did you also try to flash the IT firmware on the H330 like on the H310 to get more DQLEN..?

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ezequielcarson
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Hi.

so i should take the H330 for my setup..?! DQLEN of 32..? also with SAS..?

With SAS you will get 256. I learned this today in a post for the issue.

so with the H730 i can't do VSAN pass-through so only this Virtual SAN RAID 0..?

I don’t know if you can flash your card to support IT mode instaead of IR MODE.

thats not good... did you also try to flash the IT firmware on the H330 like on the H310 to get more DQLEN..?

Nop, I tried a lot of things, but it seems that the DQLEN directly comes from the driver type (SATA,SAS,NVM,RAID) . that’s what I understood from the other thread.

Ask David Pasek. He works for Dell.

Ezeq.

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DavidPasek
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

DELL PERC H730 was finally officially certified for VSAN. Click here for more details.

H730 support "pass-through mode" and RAID-0.

"Pass-through mode" is generally recommended for VSAN.

-- The devil is in the detail.
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ezequielcarson
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

QQ.

Why would you use 730xd instead of R630?

Txs

Ezeq.

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DavidPasek
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

The answer is in spec sheet comparison and specific VSAN related design requirements.

R630 is 1U rack server, up to 3 PCI-e slots, up to 10 x 2.5" HDD

R730xd is 2U rack server, up to 6 PCI-e slots, up to 26 x 2.5" HDD

Advantages of R730xd are

  • you can use more RAID controllers because of more PCI-e slots (it can be beneficial for VSAN higher availability and performance)
  • you can use more NICs because of more PCI-e slots (it can be beneficial for network higher availability and throughput)
  • you can use more disks (spindles) to have better performance

Advantages of R630 are

  • less physical space

Final design decision should be based on specific requirements and constraints therefore there is no

For more physical spec information look at spec sheets.

R730xd

http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell_PowerEdge_R730xd_Spe...

R630

http://i.dell.com/sites/doccontent/shared-content/data-sheets/en/Documents/Dell_PowerEdge_R630_SpecS...

-- The devil is in the detail.
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ezequielcarson
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

David, thank you for your quick response.

Would you consider using R630 with 24 1.8” instead of 730xd?

Since im using this equipment for Vsan I would everything in pass-thru and 3 FusionIO for SSD

Do you see any problem with this configuration?

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DavidPasek
Enthusiast
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It really depends on performance requirements for designed VSAN system.

1.8" disks are SATA SSDs so it depends if you need it.

SSD advantages are

  • performance
  • less power consumption
  • less cooling
  • higher density

SSD disadvantages are

  • write endurance
  • VMFS file system is not optimized for SSD so performance will drop in time



Don't think only about VSAN (storage) but think about vSphere Cluster as a whole and do a holistic design of Compute, Storage and Network resources.


Following metrics must be in good ratio fitting your capacity and performance requirements:

CPU Cores, CPU MHz, RAM GB, Disk IO/s, Disk MB/s, Net MB/s and NET Pckt/s


When you design software defined datacenter including software defined storage then you are responsible of hardware architecture and quantity metrics mentioned above must be defined as requirements or assumptions.

If you want to provide some service level agreements (SLA's) you must have or define your quality metrics like CPU RDY (%), disk response time (ms) and quality level thresholds you guarantee.

I'm so sorry I don't have better answer but this is exactly the type of "IT DEPENDS" question.

-- The devil is in the detail.
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jonretting
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

H330 if possible. PCIe NVME Performance tier, SAS Disks for data tier. If you are worried about write endurance then just get Enterprise PCIe NVME. "Anything else would be uncivilized" -Charles Barkley

Also having varying hardware between VSAN hosts adds a great deal of complexity and uncertainty around performance.

Best,

-Jon

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WhiskyTangoFoxt
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

I know that this is an old post and the original poster has probably moved on, but I will say this for anyone elses' benefit who maybe looking for the same answer. I would stay away from the H330 as it has a considerably smaller queue depth (256) vs the H710's 895.

I guess this also depends on the drives underneath and their associated queue depths;

SATA 32

NL SAS 128

SAS 254

The queue depth of your controller can be found in ESXTOP.

Two controllers and multiple VSAN disk groups would see a performance gain, as well as creating smaller failure domains. I have found that the H730 combined with a eMLC SSD cache, and SAS drives a good combination, specifically with the R730xd.

B

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