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tom12010
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MS licensing questions

If we have one (1) Windows Server 2008 R2 Datacenter license, can it apply to VMs on all 3 of our hosts??

Or does MS require 1 DC license per host??

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amvmware
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The answer is you don't - it is MS terminology for saying, if they pay you a visit - you must be able to show you have sufficient licenses for the MS OS's and apps you are running - this includes your virtual environment. This is why "assigned" is in quotes - you just have to prove you have the licenses for each host.

If that is enterprise then it is 4 vm's per license and you can "assign multiple" enterprise licenses to a single esx host, or buy datacenter OS licenses and they allow for unlimited VM's -but are licensed per CPU socket in the esx host that is used and again you can "assign" multiple datacenter OS licenses to a ESX host based on the number of processor sockets that are populated in that server.

As for vmotion, HA and DRS - I wish you had not asked !!!! - If you are using datacenter licenses for all the hosts then this is not an issue as you have unlimited VM's.

If it was enterprise edition or standard edition and MS came calling then my understanding is - and this is based on conversations with MS licensing people internally and with MS. They determine that since you have vmotiuon enabled you are capable of moving VM's around more than once in a 90 day period (This is important as it is in the OS, T&C's), so depending on the scale of you virtual environment and which way the wind is blowing when an MS rep comes calling depends on what they will say - they may decide you should purchase a few more licenses to cover for a possible imbalance in your licensing or go away happy. Sorry it is not more specific than that - but MS are making the rules up as they go along and that is why if the cost analysis works out to go with datacenter licenses then i recommend customers take up that option and then any problem with MS OS licensing goes away.

Hope this clarifies the situation.

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vmroyale
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Hello.

Or does MS require 1 DC license per host?

I'm no lawyer, but I believe it is 1 DC license per socket in each host.

Good Luck!

Brian Atkinson | vExpert | VMTN Moderator | Author of "VCP5-DCV VMware Certified Professional-Data Center Virtualization on vSphere 5.5 Study Guide: VCP-550" | @vmroyale | http://vmroyale.com
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Dave_Mishchenko
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I'm no lawyer, but I believe it is 1 DC license per socket in each host.

Send me $19.95 and I'll send you back a diploma that says you are one :). Windows DC licensing is per socket.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/en/us/licensing-datacenter.aspx




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amvmware
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MS dataccenter version licensing is per processor socket and is "assigned" to a particular esx host.

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vmroyale
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:smileylaugh: The check is in the mail!

Brian Atkinson | vExpert | VMTN Moderator | Author of "VCP5-DCV VMware Certified Professional-Data Center Virtualization on vSphere 5.5 Study Guide: VCP-550" | @vmroyale | http://vmroyale.com
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tom12010
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And how does one "assign" licenses to hosts?? -- regardless of level -- enterprise, standard, DC, etc.??

And what about moving VMs -- DRS, HA, svMotion, etc.?? -- does this mess up the licensing too??

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amvmware
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The answer is you don't - it is MS terminology for saying, if they pay you a visit - you must be able to show you have sufficient licenses for the MS OS's and apps you are running - this includes your virtual environment. This is why "assigned" is in quotes - you just have to prove you have the licenses for each host.

If that is enterprise then it is 4 vm's per license and you can "assign multiple" enterprise licenses to a single esx host, or buy datacenter OS licenses and they allow for unlimited VM's -but are licensed per CPU socket in the esx host that is used and again you can "assign" multiple datacenter OS licenses to a ESX host based on the number of processor sockets that are populated in that server.

As for vmotion, HA and DRS - I wish you had not asked !!!! - If you are using datacenter licenses for all the hosts then this is not an issue as you have unlimited VM's.

If it was enterprise edition or standard edition and MS came calling then my understanding is - and this is based on conversations with MS licensing people internally and with MS. They determine that since you have vmotiuon enabled you are capable of moving VM's around more than once in a 90 day period (This is important as it is in the OS, T&C's), so depending on the scale of you virtual environment and which way the wind is blowing when an MS rep comes calling depends on what they will say - they may decide you should purchase a few more licenses to cover for a possible imbalance in your licensing or go away happy. Sorry it is not more specific than that - but MS are making the rules up as they go along and that is why if the cost analysis works out to go with datacenter licenses then i recommend customers take up that option and then any problem with MS OS licensing goes away.

Hope this clarifies the situation.

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tom12010
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Thank you for clarifying on the server moving...MS likes getting its money. Smiley Happy

Last questions: It's my understanding that one must also purchase server licenses to go with Datacenter, is this true??

Does one simply buy a pack of licenses (say, 50) and use them over one's hosts that are licensed for Datacenter??

How does this work??

Thanks to you, this has turned into a good thread!!! Smiley Happy Smiley Happy

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amvmware
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You would buy windows 2008 datacenter OS licenses - depending on how many you needed to assign to each esx host. After that all the VM's OS's are covered by the data center licenses assigned to each esx host - so you can deploy as many microsoft OS's as you like.

You still need to license the MS apps individually - so you still need SQL , Exchange, Sharepoint licenses ..etc.

I know with the standard and enterprise edition licenses you can sit around a table with 3 MS licensing people and get 3 different answers - i am hoping that the release of hyper-v 2.0 and one would assume wider take up of that product will force MS to get its act together and provide more clarity around licensing of virtual environments - in particular for SMB cusotmers that have no need for datacenter licenses.

Sad that i know so much about MS licensing - back to painting the windows.

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tom12010
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You would buy windows 2008 datacenter OS licenses - depending on how many you needed to assign to each esx host. After that all the VM's OS's are covered by the data center licenses assigned to each esx host - so you can deploy as many microsoft OS's as you like.

I understand that one would need 6 DC licenses for 3 dual-CPU hosts. That's the easy part. Smiley Happy

My question about "server licenses" is how does one license the instances of say, Standard and Enterprise VMs on each host??

Do those require licenses too??

Or does just having the 6 DC licenses provide coverage for all the versions one installs for one's VMs per se??

I know one can get a MAK key for DC, does one use this key for all the server VMs??

I also asked one of our vendors some of these questions too, to see what answers I get.

I'm happy you are knowledgeable about MS licensing and that you also paint windows. Smiley Happy

It is good for us IT guys to do non-IT things too. Smiley Happy

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amvmware
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The assuption is that if you are large enought to require datacenter licenses then you must have an MS aggreement such as SA - so you can then use those licenses to deploy the OS's.

Doing DIY is what keeps me sane after dealing with internal politics monday to friday.

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Dave_Mishchenko
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My question about "server licenses" is how does one license the instances of say, Standard and Enterprise VMs on each host??

Do those require licenses too??

If the host is licensed with DC licenses, then you can install as many VMs as you want and the licensing is covered. You have the option to deploy Standard/ Enterprise or DataCenter within the VMs.




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tom12010
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It's not to do with the size of one's company, it's to do with how many VMs one will have.

There is a break-even point where buying multiple enterprise licenses becomes simply crazy because one buys so many to cover one's hosts etc.

Anyone with 10-20+ VMs per host and multiple hosts should buy DC...it becomes easier to think about 6 licenses vs. 10-20 enterprise licenses, since one never knows how many active VMs one will need/have over time.

Any comments or links people can offer about the breakeven point for DC vs. other versions would be helpful here.

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tom12010
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There is a break-even point where buying multiple enterprise licenses becomes simply crazy because one buys so many to cover one's hosts etc.

Any comments or links people can offer about the breakeven point for DC vs. other versions would be helpful here.

I found it: http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2003/howtobuy/licensing/calc_2.htm -- the breakeven point appears to be 7-8 servers per dual-CPU host, using retail pricing.

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amvmware
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MS have a licensing calculation web site - see below.

http://www.microsoft.com/windowsserver2008/en/us/hyperv-calculators.aspx

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TomHowarth
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MS require a DataCenter Licensed per processor, therefore if your hosts were Dual/Quad core, you would require 6 Datacenter licenses to be legal. This would however license you for unlimited instances of MS OSes on those 3 hosts.

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Tom Howarth VCP / vExpert

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Contributing author on "[VMware vSphere and Virtual Infrastructure Security: Securing ESX and the Virtual Environment|http://www.amazon.co.uk/VMware-VSphere-Virtual-Infrastructure-Security/dp/0137158009/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1256146240&sr=1-1]”.

Tom Howarth VCP / VCAP / vExpert
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Blog: http://www.planetvm.net
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Contributing author on VCP VMware Certified Professional on VSphere 4 Study Guide: Exam VCP-410
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rriva
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Ok,

so if I have 3 hosts with dual quad core xeon processor each, and I'll buy 6 Win 2008 R2 Datacenter licenses, I will be able to :

- Install how many Windows VMs I'll need ?

- Install Standard/ Enterprise and Datacenter versions ?

- Install Virtual Machines with more than two virtual cpu each ?

- Use VMotion to move VMs between the phisical hosts ?

Is it all right ?

Thank You

Riccardo Riva

VCP,RHCE,FCNSA

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RRiva | http://about.me/riccardoriva | http://www.riccardoriva.com
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AsherN
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Sounds about right.

The break even point is quite low. Standard retails for about $1K. Datacentre for about $4K per socket. Any host that runs more than 4 VMs per socket benefits from DC.

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