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mikes1p
Contributor
Contributor

ESX iSCSI with Microsoft Storage Server? And planning questions...

Has anyone tried using ESX via iSCSI to MS Storage Server? I am crazy to even be considering it?

I don't expect it would perform like a dedicated iSCSI SAN system but for the price if fits my budget. I am considering using it to move 5 or so less critical W2003 servers into VM's on ESX Std at our HQ. If I need to go for a better storage system I need to make case for it to get more money out of the CFO.

I have about $40,000 to buy a 1TB storage system for our HQ, a smaller 500Gb storage box for DR in our second location, two ESX servers (one for HQ and one for DR), and any software needed to replicate. The DR plan is to replicate data files and images of all our servers but only run the critical systems in VM's at our second site. Suggestions? I have solutions from from Dell and HP

Thanks

Mike S

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Texiwill
Leadership
Leadership

Hello,

Another option is to buy a system with lots of NIC and Disk and use the FreeNAS solution, it supports iSCSI and NFS. While it is running FreeBSD, it is a very good and inexpensive solution.

Best regards

Edward L. Haletky, author of the forthcoming 'VMWare ESX Server in the Enterprise: Planning and Securing Virtualization Servers', publishing January 2008, (c) 2008 Pearson Education. Available on Rough Cuts at http://safari.informit.com/9780132302074

--
Edward L. Haletky
vExpert XIV: 2009-2023,
VMTN Community Moderator
vSphere Upgrade Saga: https://www.astroarch.com/blogs
GitHub Repo: https://github.com/Texiwill
mikes1p
Contributor
Contributor

Thanks for the reply

I've done some reading on FreeNAS and OpenFiler, definately interesting and I am seriously considering them. I used OpenFiler at a previous job too. I didn't want my first post on this thread to be too long so Ieft out a lot of details. A consideration of mine: this is a Microsoft shop and am in the only one in IT so I want to minimize infrastructure that only I can understand. Open source is getting better all the time but getting third party support is a huge here (in case I get hit by a train), just easier sticking MS.

Also I should get something that's on the VMWare HCL, is there any whitebox/opensource solutions?

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Texiwill
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Leadership

Hello,

There is a rumor that OpenFiler will be there soon, but as for a Microsoft shop, I leave that to others to comment upon. I have never used that particular option. But I do understand your situation.

Best regards,

Edward L. Haletky, author of the forthcoming 'VMWare ESX Server in the Enterprise: Planning and Securing Virtualization Servers', publishing January 2008, (c) 2008 Pearson Education. Available on Rough Cuts at http://safari.informit.com/9780132302074

--
Edward L. Haletky
vExpert XIV: 2009-2023,
VMTN Community Moderator
vSphere Upgrade Saga: https://www.astroarch.com/blogs
GitHub Repo: https://github.com/Texiwill
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doubleH
Expert
Expert

i haven't used storage server, but i am currently playing around with Rocket Divisions Star Wind iSCSI target. it installs on top of Windows Server so it sounds like something you may want to check out...

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dennes
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

You can also consider DataCore SanMelody. It's installed on top of the Windows (Storage) server. and (while pricey when you add up all the things you need) it has all the features and capabilities of a real SAN (snapshots/replication).

Dennes

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estradar
Contributor
Contributor

We have used Openfiler in a production environment for 487 days and counting. We are currently using Windows Unified Data Storage Server on our production environment also.

Cisco 3560 anchors the iscsi gigabit storage network and two dell 5448s provide the replication backbone.

Openfiler specs: Dell 6650 4 xeons 8gbs ram coupled to a Dell powervault with 6 TBs of scsi storage. 8 w2k3 vms are running on it AD, AV server, two sql servers, 1 exchange 2003 supporting 400 users, two web servers, and a print server.

WUDSS specs: Dell NX 1950 2 quad core cpus 8gbs ram coupled to 1 MD3000 6 TBs of SAS storage and 1 MD1000 15 TBs of SATA storage. Currently the WUDSS is being used for data storage and snapshots.

On a head to head using the same hardware Openfiler runs circles on WUDSS. In 487 days the openfiler has not been rebooted, in the last 60 days the WUDSS has been rebooted 9 times. 4 more 6650s will become availible soon they will be turned into openfiler boxes.

Save your cash we almost bought a $60k EMC 2 TB san solution overrated bigtime. robocopy and rsync are being used for replication and snapshots.

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daniel_uk
Hot Shot
Hot Shot

Not sure on costs but what about a Netapp Storevault?

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estradar
Contributor
Contributor

Daniel,

The storevault ,unless you buy their high end versions, are basically a

Windows Unified Data Storage Server the same goes for SAN Melody.

Openfiler has been working very well for us. The only deficiency on

openfiler is the block level replication, but rsync and robocopy can

handle that very well nobody is perfect Smiley Happy

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nitin_m
Contributor
Contributor

Try to use e-open DSS lite. Lot of people have been using it(as per their forums) - plus it installs on USB

Openfiler has not seen any development since.....6 months?

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old_netware_gee
Contributor
Contributor

I would avoid Open-E DSS, we have spent a ton of cash on them and the results is not great. It's build on debian but good luck getting to a CLI of any sort. With DSS you stuck using what they tell you to use.

We built out own for about $10,000. ISCSI SAN from scratch. It's a Sun 64bit AMD system with 4 infiniband 4x cards plugged right into out esx servers - its runs great.

As far as MSS, well I've tried it and the performance is not so hot. there is way to much overhead with the OS it self and on the wire.

If your a MS shop well then follow suit or start a movment. Smiley Wink

-JT

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kukacz
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Mike,

few months ago I tested MS iSCSI target for the purpose you're describing. The reasons why we didn't recommended it to our custommer were:

- It works the way it stores all LUNs as common files on NTFS filesystem. Just imagine how long chain of filesystems and LUNs you're creating from VM down - they are: NTFS (as an example of VM fs) -> vmdk file on VMFS -> MS iSCSI file on NTFS -> some real storage LUN

- The performance penalty was acceptable, but really not a fast one.

- You can't build a high-available solution with it, since you can't have a mirrored storage and MS cluster together. MS dynamic disks don't work with MS cluster and even Symantes SFW disk mirroring doesn't work with MS cluster and iSCSI target. I spent lot of time trying to make it work this way with no result.

- MS iSCSI Target had the worse product support I had ever seen in IT.

Solutions like open-e, WinTarget don't support clustering and mirroring together.

I would recommend to you LeftHand VSA for start. It can use your ESX server's local storage, provide synchronous mirroring features, snapshots and replications to remote site. You can evaluate it for free, just look here: http://www.lefthandnetworks.com/vsa_eval.aspx When you start with VSA, you can easily scale up to LeftHand's hardware cluster solution.

--

Lukas Kubin

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kimchong
Contributor
Contributor

This question is for Ed:

Can you think of any disadvantages/deficiencies of VMware ESX 3.5

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