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AlexsYB
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

VDR 2 and my hair loss!

Hi

I took over a ESX cluster that was using VDR as the backup tool.

Each VDR VM has 2 data stores 1 local and 1 remote DC

There are 2 VDR's one in the data center and 1 in the Office.

The remote datastore is at at 3rd Datacentre.

I have yet to get 2 weeks of backups running with out there being some issue, some sort of corruption in the remote data store. (and some but not as many on the local datastore).

I am finding it very annoying and very un reliable

What are the alternatives.... I like being able to store stuff local for quick restores and I must have offsite backups.  And I reall really like the dedup facility .  I just hate the fragile nature of VDR....

Alex

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12 Replies
idle-jam
Immortal
Immortal

have a look at Veeam Backup & Replication (2 in 1) and comes with de-duplication and compression.

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phykell
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

What sort of corruption are you seeing and how are your destinations connected - RDM, NFS, CIFS, etc.?

If you're having difficulties with the remote destination, the chances are that it's the nature of the connection which is the issue for at least some of the problems you're having. I guess you might see the same sort of problems if you were running a VM with an attached disk mounted on a remote datastore - which is probably not recommended due to latency issues.

Personally, I'd recommend looking at your VMs and how they organise their data. See if you can split your VM into two VMDKs, one for the O/S and the other for data - that way, you can use VDR to backup your VM's O/S partition and use your VM O/S backup application (e.g. in Windows Server) to backup your data locally and remotely. As an alternative, and where an agent-based solution is preferable, consider a commercial application as mentioned by the previous poster.

Please award points if you find my answer helpful Smiley Happy

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AlexsYB
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

phykell wrote:

What sort of corruption are you seeing and how are your destinations connected - RDM, NFS, CIFS, etc.?

If you're having difficulties with the remote destination, the chances are that it's the nature of the connection which is the issue for at least some of the problems you're having. I guess you might see the same sort of problems if you were running a VM with an attached disk mounted on a remote datastore - which is probably not recommended due to latency issues.

Personally, I'd recommend looking at your VMs and how they organise their data. See if you can split your VM into two VMDKs, one for the O/S and the other for data - that way, you can use VDR to backup your VM's O/S partition and use your VM O/S backup application (e.g. in Windows Server) to backup your data locally and remotely. As an alternative, and where an agent-based solution is preferable, consider a commercial application as mentioned by the previous poster.

Please award points if you find my answer helpful Smiley Happy

Hi

The connection is being done by NFS.  its a short travel time ni the order of 11-15ms its a monitored server and my ISP tell me they are seeing no errors on the line. I manage the routers at the end and I see no errors on the line!

he disk becomes unusable until integrity check is run, again and again and again.

Yes the recommendation would (should) work, so should VDR.  I really don't want to have to go to all this extra work to simply make it work.

So atleast in my book VDR should be used for any real sort of backups (atleats where you want to be able to sleep at night).  Fix it up VMWare, good start.

This has been my experience so far.  Of to try out VEEAM

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phykell
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

...so you've got a VMDK deployed on a remote NFS volume? What's your bandwidth like and is your latency fairly consistent or is it variable? Are you seeing any specific error messages reported by VDR? A VMDK is not usually connected to a server over a WAN connection and for good reason - they are notoriously unreliable for replication tasks where data integrity is critical, and a simple ping value isn't really going to give you the level of detail you need to properly evaluate the suitability of your connection. Can you be absolutely sure that there are no service interruptions on your WAN line? Are you using any firewalls?

While VDR certainly does have some issues, I think any problems supporting a remote VMDK destination are due to vSphere because it's just not an anticipated configuration. An ESXi server will generally expect an attached datastore to be presented on a SCSI interface or a local network at Gigabit speeds.

Good luck with Veeam Smiley Happy

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AlexsYB
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Hi

? Sorry I think we have crossed wires. My VDR VM runs on the ESX server where all the VM’s to be backed up are stored. It has 2 attached disks, one local and one remote.

As for links. Like I said it is a monitored link, with associated sla’s etc. a quick check of the counters on the interface of the routers at both ends shows me I am not losing an CD or counting any errors. As for increased latency do to traffic – I would expect to see some dropped packets – which I am not.

I have more issues with the remote datastore, than the local datastore. But the local also has issues.

“WAN connection and for good reason - they are notoriously unreliable for replication tasks where data integrity is critical,”

Maybe back in the old days, this might be true, but WAN links are getting a lot better than they were before. I presume there is error checking in the transfers so if a packet has to be resent that shouldn’t be a problem..

If its timing why don’t I get time out error (sorry I haven’t kept my errors, normal practise for me is to remove them all and restart an integrity test).

I have reliably use rsync across these types of links.

Alex

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bithead2
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

I know it goes without saying, but hair loss *can* be a sign of a serious medical problem.  Please consider consulting a competent physician.  You are, ideally, looking for one with a VCP and /or VCDX certification......

CJ

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AlexsYB
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

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phykell
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

It's OK, I do think I understand the layout you're using - I just think VDR has been designed to assume destinations are on a local network at least. All of us administrators would love to be able to vMotion and storage vMotion across data centres for example but WAN links, whilst having improved a great deal, are still prohibitive regarding such desirable features...

Perhaps an approach to consider would be to have your destinations implemented locally and use replication technology to your remote datacenter instead?

Regarding the issues with your local storage, what sort of storage device are you using? Is it a dedicated NAS appliance or a Windows Server, etc.?

Incidentally, rsync is specifically designed to reliably synchronise data between a source and a remote target - I doubt VDR would be able to compete given the platform it resides on, assuming local storage, etc.

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cag201110141
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

I have similar problems.   This is what support gave me to change with the VDR application.

I have posted this in another thread.

See if these settings help.

http://communities.vmware.com/message/1892006#1892006

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rash127
Contributor
Contributor

First thing I would recommend doing is to look at what backup product is used for physical infrastructure. Many backup products now integrate through VMware VADP. Something to check before investing in a point product just for VMware infrastructure.

Since you have an ESX cluster and you also talk about offsite storage of backups, I think yours is an enterprise environment. If your physical environment is protected by NetBackup, you can make use of NetBackup for VMware for everything that you are looking for. Single-pane-of-glass management, V-Ray, deduplication, true offhost backups, full protection for vCenter, resource efficient scheduling etc. Well, now I am starting to sound like an advertiser, so I will stop.

Again, see what you have for non-VMware backups. Chances are that you may have already invested in a product that also provides VMware protection!

Disclaimer: I work for Symantec. Comments are my own.

Warm regards,

Rasheed

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AlexsYB
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

rash127 wrote:

First thing I would recommend doing is to look at what backup product is used for physical infrastructure. Many backup products now integrate through VMware VADP. Something to check before investing in a point product just for VMware infrastructure.

Since you have an ESX cluster and you also talk about offsite storage of backups, I think yours is an enterprise environment. If your physical environment is protected by NetBackup, you can make use of NetBackup for VMware for everything that you are looking for. Single-pane-of-glass management, V-Ray, deduplication, true offhost backups, full protection for vCenter, resource efficient scheduling etc. Well, now I am starting to sound like an advertiser, so I will stop.

Again, see what you have for non-VMware backups. Chances are that you may have already invested in a product that also provides VMware protection!

Disclaimer: I work for Symantec. Comments are my own.

Warm regards,

Rasheed

Thanks very good suggestion, except we are 99.999% Vmware and use Micosoft backup server for exchange and AD- with in VM's...  We relied upon VDR but its luck that I get a good weekends backups....

I am tracking another forum, where there are some suggestions to make changes to the OS, like open file handles, going to try that and also look at VEEAM

Alex

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AlexsYB
Enthusiast
Enthusiast

Okay another fine example. Both of my VDR2 vm's are having issues with both the local and the remote destinations oh yeah !

-2241 errors....

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