1 2 Previous Next 19 Replies Latest reply on Sep 30, 2019 8:44 AM by ChrisFD2

    vCenter HA v.s. FT

    IvarHome Enthusiast

      Hi, can I FT vCenter instad of vCenter HA? The idea comes because FT dont have such high requirements as vCenter HA (3 nodes and 16GB ram).

        • 1. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
          Richardson Porto Champion
          User ModeratorsCommunity Warriors

          Yes, you can use FT to protect your vCenter, but there is a limitation on number of vCPU that FT support, for instance, FT on vSphere 6.0 Enterprise Plus support protect a VM with up to 4 vCPU, in that case, you can use FT to protect vCenter only for the tiny and small deployment type, 2 vCPU and 4 vCPU, respectively.

           

          Please refer to the following VMware KB article for supported vCenter high availability options: VMware Knowledge Base

          ---

          Richardson Porto
          Senior Infrastructure Specialist
          LinkedIn: http://linkedin.com/in/richardsonporto
          • 2. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
            sk84 Expert
            vExpert

            Basically that should be possible, but I never tested it.

             

            However, only a maximum of 8 vCPUs per FT VM are supported (for vSphere 6.7). So only the small and medium deployment sizes of VCSA 6.7 could be covered. You also need Enterprise Plus licensing for using 8 vCPUs in a FT VM. With Standard and Enterprise license only 2 vCPUs per VM are possible. And for Essentials editions fault tolerance isn't available at all.

             

            Apart from that, FT has many limitations. You should therefore consider carefully whether a specific use case is actually suitable for FT.

             

            Anyway, the main question is; What is cheaper?

             

            In times when memory costs nothing and many ESXi hosts have far more than 128 GB RAM, the 16 GB doesn't matter. In contrast you have to pay for an Enterprise Plus license for x sockets, where only a fraction of the users would benefit from the features of this highest license edition.

             

            Fault Tolerance Requirements, Limits, and Licensing

            Fault Tolerance Interoperability

            • 3. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
              daphnissov Guru
              Community WarriorsvExpert

              And to add to what others have said, let me point out the fact that if you don't have 10 GbE NICs on your ESXi hosts you can forget about SMP-FT as it isn't going to work. It seems stupid that you'd go to these lengths (NICs, licensing, etc) to simply avoid the RAM spend on the very feature which is specifically designed to protect vCenter. But, as I constantly discover in my years as a consultant, people want stupid things all the time  : )

              • 4. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                IvarHome Enthusiast

                Ok, thanks to all, it was helpful. 2 vCPU is enough for me. FT important restriction seems you cant take snapshots with mormoy. But I readed snapshots without memory are still allowed, so backup software must work.......But now I see I have other problems. In documentation this 10Gb NIC is as "suggestion", there arent sayed it refuses to work with 1Gb nic, altough the traffic may still stuck, that I believe. Of course buy more RAM is nothing problem, but I cant do that, my ESXi is in barebon computer, it dont support more ram, it only have 8GB. Also it have only one nic, integrated. As just now I readed FT minimum is 2x physical nic, then I cant set up FT to that ESXi. Of course I have other ESXi-s with more physical nics and more ram, but I just wanted to put this small barebon ESXi into FT. So, seems EMC RecoverPoint should only option for me. vSphere HA is also option, but as I like to use local SSD-s and not networked storage, then HA also not in question.

                • 5. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                  daphnissov Guru
                  vExpertCommunity Warriors

                  You sure seem to like to go to a bunch of trouble to make up for the fact that you don't have an adequate setup to run vSphere with the type of availability you want. My advice:  Spend a few more <currency> and get half-way decent hardware to begin with.

                  • 6. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                    IvarHome Enthusiast

                    My advice:  Spend a few more <currency> and get half-way decent hardware to begin with.

                     

                      Its not very possible, as this all is my personal home hardware and software and Im pensioner. I dont earn no any money with it, its just for fun (as pensioner, I still cant stop administration) and I already spend lots of money. But in future, of course, if I can I always buy something new.

                    • 7. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                      IvarHome Enthusiast

                      Altough I dont see real demand for 10Gbit network. Example I want replicate or put in FT windows operating system. What the hell it needs 10 Gbit traffic? There is no such traffic. When windows is in idle, there is almost not at all io traffic. I have example windows running on 1 Gbit Qnap iSCSI. The latency is little higher than internal SSD, but still no any problem. All this is just bad software development, not real demand. In old days, there wasnt at all 10 Gbit networks, but Veritas synchronous replication still worked. And this 2x nic requirement is also stupidity.

                      • 8. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                        sk84 Expert
                        vExpert

                        Just because you don't understand the technology doesn't mean it's a stupid solution or bad software development.

                         

                        FT replicates ALL network packets, ALL CPU cycles, ALL memory changes and ALL IO requests in real time. In the event of a host failure, no network packet, IO request or CPU instruction will be lost. Can Veritas do that too? No, of course not, because you compare FT with a pure storage replication solution. ;-)

                         

                        And it's also clear that the 10 Gbit will not be used completely if the system is only in idle state. But FT is not intended for systems that do nothing because it wouldn't be necessary to keep them high available.

                        • 9. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                          IvarHome Enthusiast

                          Why not necessary? Me interest only disk IO replication, I dont need realtime failover.

                          • 10. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                            sk84 Expert
                            vExpert

                            Your words:

                            Altough I dont see real demand for 10Gbit network. Example I want replicate or put in FT windows operating system. What the hell it needs 10 Gbit traffic? There is no such traffic. When windows is in idle, there is almost not at all io traffic. I have example windows running on 1 Gbit Qnap iSCSI. The latency is little higher than internal SSD, but still no any problem. All this is just bad software development, not real demand. In old days, there wasnt at all 10 Gbit networks, but Veritas synchronous replication still worked. And this 2x nic requirement is also stupidity.

                             

                            If you only need disk IO replication, then FT is the wrong solution anyway. No need to say "All this is just bad software development" or "And this 2x nic requirement is also stupidity". You either don't know what you want, or you choose the wrong solutions and then insult them because they don't fit your problem.

                             

                            But to be honest, I don't feel like dealing with it anymore. We already know that it's only for a homelab and your hardware is limited and you just want to tinker. Maybe Linux and KVM would be better suited for you than an enterprise virtualization solution that addresses the needs and financial possibilities of companies.

                            • 11. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                              IvarHome Enthusiast

                              So, whats the problem with "homelab"? We all live in homes. Hardware is always limited. There is no unlimited hardware. My hardware fit to requirements, except 2 NIC, all is just fit. Of course, there is no real demand for 2 nic in technology aspect of view.   And "addresses the needs and financial possibilities of companies". Do you think hypervisor know about my finances or companies? I dont need your company either.

                              • 12. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                                daphnissov Guru
                                Community WarriorsvExpert

                                The problem isn't your home lab. The problem is that you're wanting to do ridiculous things in round-about ways with clearly incapable hardware (i.e., going to extreme lengths to provide higher availability for vCenter [RecoverPoint and FT] rather than using vCHA). It's a home lab, not a production environment. If you won't invest in mediocre hardware in order to implement the correct feature for the desired effect, stop trying to do these types of things that are more demanding than what you own. If you want to drive a nail you need a hammer, not a sandal. Most people realize these limitations and tailor their actions accordingly, but not you it would seem. So I'm also throwing in the towel as far as helping you goes. Good luck.

                                • 13. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                                  IvarHome Enthusiast

                                  I readed RecoverPoint requirements and my hardware fit. 2 vCPUs / 4 GB ram. And 1 nic. There is no 10Gbit requirements in documentation. But still dont work. Here also nobody dont know why. Ok, I understand, here is not correct forum for RecoverPoint. My mistake. But I have experiences, I have tested hundreds of software. I collect software. And most of enterprise software works with even less resources than is written in documentation, especially VMWare. Example, first, ESXi dont need compatibility hardware. Also you can use nic-s not in list, but have written drivers for it by somebody. NSX components work with much less resources than is written in documentation. There is even blocking against VM settings change, but it can unlock. By documentation, only dedicated Nvidia cards works with vDGA or passthrough. Actually all AMD cards work. Dont you see the point. The point is - just buy more hardware, pay more money. There is nothing to do with technology.   

                                  • 14. Re: vCenter HA v.s. FT
                                    sk84 Expert
                                    vExpert

                                    You just don't want to understand. VMware is an ENTERPRISE solution. So the recommendations and requirements are not based on any homelab and the lowest level, but are designed to work well in enterprise environments with the workloads of an enterprise environment. And VMware must be able to support the whole thing. That means, the requirements and setups are largely standardized to keep support requests as low as possible.

                                    Once again, VMware products are not built for tinkering, but to virtualize the IT environments of companies so that they can make money. I know you'll say now that if the requirements weren't so high and the VMware products didn't cost so much money, companies could make even more money with that. But that's not the way the world works and maybe you therefore read my first sentences again.

                                    And the HCL is only partially managed by VMware. In many cases, manufacturers are responsible for getting their hardware onto the HCL. So complain to AMD, not VMware.

                                    You wrote, that you have so much experience, but then you should know these things...

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