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      • 255. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
        Frank.Heidbuchel Novice

        maybe vmware should start selling hardware.

        some old dual core cpu servers with 24GB memory in them...

         

        as i don't know where to buy these old boxes...

        • 256. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
          Tugboat201110141 Lurker

          The other thing to consider is even if you have a dual socket 64Gb server with 2 Enterprise licenses and think you are covered, you may not be.  If you make use of TPS to over subscribe memory you can blow right past the 64Gb limit and need additional licenses.  Lots of things to think about and consider.  While using memory for license counts may not be a bad idea, the amount allowed per license level is seriously low.  Before this we never would have given Hyper-V a second look.  Now my boss wants me to put it in our dev / test environment.  Already there are licenses we won't be upgrading and if it works out we may be putting it in production.  

          • 257. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
            gmitch64 Enthusiast

            > Companies with larger 4-socket servers will not be effected as bad

            > unless they have gone above and beyond 132GB's of RAM per host.

             

            Who the heck buys a 4 socket server with less than 132GB of memory? Especially for virtualization. Heck, we are buying 2 core servers with 256GB. If we went 4 core, we'd probably double that.

             

             

            G

            • 258. Re: Start new threads?
              odonnellj Enthusiast

              JohnTroyer, that was beautifully explained especially about the realities of "right sizing" vm's as some means of solving this problem.

              • 259. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                AlbertWT Master

                No, actually I have 61 GB on my 8 new blades, based on my approved budget I only need to buy 2CPU sockets x 8 unit = 16 Enterprise plus license on VSphere 4.1)

                But as for vsphere 5 I’m not sure if I have to buy

                 

                61x8 / 48  = 10.1 license ?

                • 260. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                  JDLangdon Master

                  Albert Widjaja wrote:

                   

                  No, actually I have 61 GB on my 8 new blades, based on my approved budget I only need to buy 2CPU sockets x 8 unit = 16 Enterprise plus license on VSphere 4.1)

                  But as for vsphere 5 I’m not sure if I have to buy

                   

                  61x8 / 48  = 10.1 license ?

                   

                  vSphere 5 licenses are based on the amount of RAM.  For a single blade with 2xCPU and 61GB of RAM you will need to purchase 2 vSphere Enterprise Plus licenses.

                  • 261. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                    RogerThomas Novice

                    Albert Widjaja wrote:

                     

                    No, actually I have 61 GB on my 8 new blades, based on my approved budget I only need to buy 2CPU sockets x 8 unit = 16 Enterprise plus license on VSphere 4.1)

                    But as for vsphere 5 I’m not sure if I have to buy

                     

                    61x8 / 48  = 10.1 license ?

                    You still have to licence each physical CPU so you will need 16 licences, you will only have an issue if you go above 92GBytes of allocated vRAM across all your systems - so a total of 736 of active vRAM.

                     

                    This means you currently do not lose out due to the change, but what are your memory plans for these nodes over the next year or so?

                    • 262. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                      Frank.Heidbuchel Novice

                      I think if vmware insist on these mem limits.

                      they should forget the CPU limits totaly and focus on max physical memory only.

                      example

                       

                      ess 48GB

                      std  64GB

                      ent  96GB

                      ent plus 128GB

                       

                      this way you can choose the edition based on features and buy mulitple of them to get to the total physical memory you want to use over all your servers.

                      so if you have 2 servers with a 64GB each

                      you could buy 2 std editions or 1 ent plus to reach the memory limit

                       

                      this way more people would go to ent plus, and get the newer features...

                      where vmware is premium in.

                      and as memory requirements go up... vmware's license counts also goes up.

                      making them more money...

                      but you can still overcommit with no problem...

                      • 263. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                        DANCHUFT Novice

                        I too was excitedly reading through the new vSphere 5 specs until I stumbled upon the new licensing model 

                         

                        We currently have 2 Socket 128GB RAM Blades running Ent Edition. For us to move to vSphere 5 we would have to double our current license count! Being an NHS Trust I can't see the funding being approved for the migration to vSphere 5 any time soon.

                         

                        To penalise people who are achieving high consolidation ratios, which was one of the main drives behind virtualisation seems to be a major own goal by VMware. I wonder if the increase in revenue from the extra licensing costs will outweigh the amount of people who will surely abandon vSphere in favour of HyperV in today's financial climate?

                        • 264. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                          odonnellj Enthusiast

                          The worst thing to do is to start negotiating vRAM levels. The whole concept is absurd and should be scrapped and an apology given.

                          • 265. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                            tietzjd25 Enthusiast

                            jbonicki wrote:

                             

                            I totally agree with you. The new licensing model is even worse on the SMB side:

                             

                            Today:

                            2 x DL380 G7, 2 CPUs and 96 GB RAM each = Essentials Plus Kit

                             

                            Tomorrow:

                            2 x DL380 G7, 2 CPUs and 96 GB RAM each = Standard Kit

                             

                            That is about 300% (yes, THREE HUNDRED PERCENT) increase in price. Good luck explaining the added cost to your boss .

                             

                            Take care

                            jacek

                             

                            Are you designing for N+1? If so you should fine with Essentials Plus Kit for 2 servers. You should not be using much more than 96 GB of memory if your design is N+1.

                             

                            Essentials Plus Kit is 144GB Max. Pooled vRAM that means if you using 2 servers and are only using 144GB of memory (In your case

                            75% of total memory)

                             

                            Even if you buy standard it's just 24GB per CPU at 6 CPU you sitll only entiled to 144GB of VRAM. You will have bump up to Ent or ENT + if want more vRAM per CPU.

                             

                            Always remember it's vRAM used! Not total memory in the systems. 

                            • 266. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                              sergeadam Enthusiast

                              I've been preaching ESX for close to 8 years now. I just started here a couple of months ago. My company is embarking on a virtualization project. My predecessor bought 3 R710, dual CPUs, 2 X 96GB and 1 32GB. Essential Plus license. I'll have a HA cluster. My standard image for a 2008R2 server is 4GB and goes up from there. vSphere 5 allows me 144GB. I'll be over that. Even designing for HA, it is not unheard of to overallocate vRAM. In all my clusters up until now, I've always had servers that did not need to restart in the event of a host failure. If a host fails, it will be fixed within 12 hours. I can afford to have monitors, AV, and a whole bunch of 'helper' servers down for a while. 

                               

                              Since I'm just starting my project, I'll now be loading Hyper-V and giving that a good trial. I already own Windows Enterprise. I don't need any ESX features other than what Essentials Plus gives me. Hyper-V may just be good enough.

                               

                              Sad day.

                              • 267. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                                hellraiser Enthusiast

                                vRAM is irrelevant - if I'm going to pay for RAM to add to a server, then it's necessary. I am unlikely to have the luxury of pools of hundreds of gigabytes of RAM installed that I won't be using!

                                 

                                JD

                                • 268. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                                  tietzjd25 Enthusiast

                                  DANCHUFT wrote:

                                   

                                  I too was excitedly reading through the new vSphere 5 specs until I stumbled upon the new licensing model 

                                   

                                  We currently have 2 Socket 128GB RAM Blades running Ent Edition. For us to move to vSphere 5 we would have to double our current license count! Being an NHS Trust I can't see the funding being approved for the migration to vSphere 5 any time soon.

                                   

                                  To penalise people who are achieving high consolidation ratios, which was one of the main drives behind virtualisation seems to be a major own goal by VMware. I wonder if the increase in revenue from the extra licensing costs will outweigh the amount of people who will surely abandon vSphere in favour of HyperV in today's financial climate?

                                  I going to harp on this

                                   

                                  4 ENT Edition lic = 128 vRAM in use..... Are you not designed for N+1 failover?

                                  • 269. Re: vSphere 5 Licensing
                                    pnewell Enthusiast

                                    Wow, 263 posts on this thread, and it hasn't even been around for two days!

                                     

                                    I'm throwing my opinion in as well, in that I too agree that the vRAM entitlement is way too low.  I sincerely hope that VMware decides to re-evaluate the vRAM licensing option (increase it, generously, or get rid of it all together), as this will cause a massive defection of VMware customers to the competition.  Myself included.

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