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1 2 Previous Next 15 Replies Last post: Aug 8, 2006 11:51 AM by aagrawal  

Grid-Appliace posted: Jun 5, 2006 12:31 AM

Click to view VMTN Admin's profile Expert 1,468 posts since
May 10, 2006
http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/296

Plug-and-play solution capable of building Virtual Computing Farms delivering Supercomputing powers to end-users on their system

Re: Grid-Appliace

1. Jun 6, 2006 6:15 PM in response to: VMTN Admin
Click to view Judge-Dredd's profile Novice 8 posts since
Jun 6, 2006
What does the appliance do and what unique value does it provide to the intended audience:
This is an interesting and appealing concept, I look forward to seeing how well it works in reality.

Innovative use of virtualization technology:
Minor. Distributed virtual clusters are an interesting use of virtualization, however I am unsure if this could actually be called innovative.

Size of the appliance relative to functionality and performance:
At over 1GB this appliance seems very large and I don't believe that it provides enough functionality to justify this size. Could a sub 100MB version be built?

Comments:
In general, appliances should not require the user to access the command line, however my understanding is that the purpose of this appliance is to run command line programs on the virtual super computer thus necessitating use of the command line. Although I am interested in trying out this appliance the size would probably deter me from downloading it. I feel that this concept could be better implemented in a smaller and more user friendly appliance.

Note : This review is based only on the appliance description, not on the actual appliance

Re: Grid-Appliace

2. Jun 8, 2006 10:28 AM in response to: VMTN Admin
Click to view calbin's profile Lurker 1 posts since
Jun 8, 2006
Another entry provides virtual cluster technology through a web interface with a more resonable size (252MB).
http://www.vmware.com/vmtn/appliances/directory/355

Re: Grid-Appliace

3. Jun 9, 2006 1:46 PM in response to: Judge-Dredd
Click to view rjfig's profile Lurker 2 posts since
Jun 9, 2006
Glad to see your interest. The innovative aspects of this appliance are that the distributed virtual cluster is wide-area, ad-hoc, requires zero configuration from the part of the user to form virtual network connections, and connects to VMs behind NATs. As far as we know, this has never been done before.

Yes, at this point users do need to be command-line savvy and understand how to use basic Condor commands to make use of this appliance.

We have created a smaller version of the appliance (380MB), we are checking if it is possible to replace the old image under the appliance challenge rules.

Re: Grid-Appliace

4. Jun 9, 2006 2:12 PM in response to: calbin
Click to view rjfig's profile Lurker 2 posts since
Jun 9, 2006
Yes, the appliance you point to is also an interesting one, and is closely related.

The key difference is that, in the Grid appliance, you can access resources from other users across the network that have also contributed to an ad-hoc pool by starting Grid appliances. As of right now, the ad-hoc pool has 13 nodes, so if you start a Grid appliance now you will be able to submit jobs to all these nodes (and the pool will become larger).

In the appliance you point out, you need to own the cluster to start a virtual cluster in it.

Re: Grid-Appliace

5. Jul 30, 2006 9:35 AM in response to: VMTN Admin
Click to view llu's profile Lurker 1 posts since
Jul 30, 2006
I tried your appliance and I would say you guys have done a great job. I had some jobs but not enough computing power to run them. The only solution in my mind was to buy a cluster but I think using your stuff, i can get it done cheap. Is this the latest version and how can i customize it for my purpose??

Re: Grid-Appliace

6. Jul 30, 2006 6:32 PM in response to: llu
Click to view aagrawal's profile Novice 6 posts since
Jul 17, 2006
The most latest version of the appliance can be found at www.acis.ufl.edu/~ipop/grid_appliance. You can customize the appliance yourself. We would be more than happy to provide the root password. please send a mail to aagrawal@acis.ufl.edu

Re: Grid-Appliace

7. Aug 3, 2006 7:57 PM in response to: VMTN Admin
Click to view coderman's profile Lurker 5 posts since
May 30, 2006
thanks for the clarification

Re: Grid-Appliace

8. Aug 1, 2006 9:02 AM in response to: coderman
Click to view rubbolt's profile Novice 8 posts since
Jul 20, 2006
Great point coderman. Could you share your trick with all of us, so we can expand our horizons?

eagerly waiting for the enlightenment.

cheers

Message was edited by:
rubbolt

Re: Grid-Appliace

9. Aug 4, 2006 4:12 PM in response to: coderman
Click to view aagrawal's profile Novice 6 posts since
Jul 17, 2006
Thanks coderman. I hope you are satisfied with the clarification

Re: Grid-Appliace

10. Aug 2, 2006 7:11 AM in response to: rubbolt
Click to view aagrawal's profile Novice 6 posts since
Jul 17, 2006
I think the best way to expand your horizons, is to think innovative and create something in which people see some value and benefits. I think our work brings a lot of value and advantage to the people hungry of computing power and that's the reason we got our horizons expanded.

I have couple of innovative ideas on Wireless Power and Virtual Presence and would be more than glad to share with you which can help you expand your horizons to the entire globe and the enlightment can be summarized in few words "An idea can change your life". Just think about it and read the biographies of the 10 most famous and rich people you know and hopefully you would be able to get the enlightment.

--Abhishek

Re: Grid-Appliace

11. Aug 4, 2006 4:11 PM in response to: coderman
Click to view aagrawal's profile Novice 6 posts since
Jul 17, 2006
Thanks Coderman. If you are interested in this, I would be more than happy to work with you so that you can understand the great power this appliance can bring to you. We have a design documet available at www.acis.ufl.edu/~ipop/grid_appliance which can provide you with all the technical insights about how the appliance was designed and what all core technologies it uses.

Re: Grid-Appliace

12. Aug 4, 2006 6:33 AM in response to: VMTN Admin
Click to view coderman's profile Lurker 5 posts since
May 30, 2006
' Deploying Virtual Machines as Sandboxes for the Grid'

http://www.cs.wisc.edu/condor/doc/SandboxingWorlds053.pdf

"...The ability to securely run arbitrary untrusted code on
a wide variety of execution platforms is a challenging
problem in the Grid community. One way to achieve
this is to run the code inside a contained, isolated en-
vironment, namely a “sandbox”. Virtual machines pro-
vide a natural solution to the security and resource man-
agement issues that arise in sandboxing. We explore dif-
ferent designs for the VM-enabled sandbox and evaluate
them with respect to various factors like structure, secu-
rity guarantees, user convenience, feasibility and over-
heads in one such grid environment. Our experiments
indicate that the use of on-demand VMs imposes a con-
stant startup overhead, with I/O-intensive applications
incurring additional overheads depending on the design
of the sandbox.
"

Re: Grid-Appliace

13. Aug 5, 2006 3:22 PM in response to: coderman
Click to view aagrawal's profile Novice 6 posts since
Jul 17, 2006
Thanks for pointing this out. But I am not sure, what is the point you are trying to make. If you are interested in this field, I can point you to several other similar works. The strength of our work is that our approach is self-configuring and self-organizing and combines a lot of things to deliver the final appliance. It uses Peer-to-Peer at its base routing layer which provides scalability, fault-tolerance and decentralization. It tunnels IP over Peer-to-Peer. On top of that it creates a Virtual IP network and uses the power of Condor(the key component of the paper you just pointed out) for distributed scheduling. We package everything in a small VM image and the image is configured and customized that when it boots up, it contacts a public server, gets an IP address on the Virtual Network and becomes a part of the Grid-Appliance network and can submit jobs to all the machines in the network using condor.

Please enlighten me what specifically you want to bring up by pointing out to this paper and I would be more than glad to answer your specific questions or concerns. More details can be found at:

http://boykin.acis.ufl.edu/wiki/index.php/PeerVM
http://boykin.acis.ufl.edu/wiki/index.php/IPOP
http://boykin.acis.ufl.edu/wiki/index.php/WOW

--Abhishek

Re: Grid-Appliace

14. Aug 7, 2006 7:20 PM in response to: aagrawal
Click to view coderman's profile Lurker 5 posts since
May 30, 2006
the point i was trying to highlight is the security and isolation benefit of virtualization (though the example in the paper referenced a xen implementation, which was a secondary point to highlight the importance of this technique to VMWare)

as for your implementation, please use care when using the terms "peer to peer" and "decentralized". while aspects of your implementation are indeed "peer to peer" like these terms typically refer to systems devoid of central points of failure / control, like the initial server contact for IP (centrally managed) and so on.

there are also significant security and scalability problems with the DHT/CAN style decentralized lookup methods which lend them applicability in tightly controlled / internal domains (private grid computing) rather than public and untrusted networks where malicious nodes can perform effective attacks against routing tables and digital identities with very little overhead. (see the p2p-hackers list archives for lots of discussion on this topic)

thanks again for the info, and keep up the interesting work.

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